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[Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules? 
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Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 9:19 pm
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Post [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Over in another thread, Jasonga, creator of The Veggie Patch, said:

jasonga wrote:
Thank you for the praise! I love the setting of the game (not too surprising :) - one day I'd like to write a supplement or two for it to cover the Wilds and the Wizards house), but I think the rules within the game need some major overhauling. Hopefully if you get a chance to run it the rules won't get in the way of the enjoyment for you and your players.


I've read Veggie Patch and have threatened my local gaming communitywith playing it for a year now, but I haven't had a chance to actually run it. This will probably happen in May.

Now we're a pretty flexible and experimental group, and these rules are very, very simple, so I can't really see them being a gamebreaker. But what kind of problems should I anticipate?

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Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:12 pm
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Location: Hobart, TAS, Australia
Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Now you've done it - I had to go and re-read the rules in the game to remind myself what I didn't like about them :) After the re-read I don't think it's as bad as I remember it, but there are two areas I think that need work (which I think are what coloured my memory).

While it does what I want it to, I think the way I implemented eating compost <-> healing <-> getting "fat" sequence is somewhat inelegant. I like the concept, but there's got to be a better way to do it.

The other area that I believe needs (major) work is the economy section. I think it's broken :) Not the idea of bartering, but the trade values I gave a lot of the items.

(BTW - I realise few people actually have a copy of the game. If anyone wants a copy to look at - either so they can comment on the rules or just to see what the hell a game about intelligent moving vegetables is like, send me a PM and I'll give you a link to download it for free. Offer expires at the end of March (so I don't have to give away free copies forever :) )).

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Jason Anderson
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Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:41 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
I didn't look too closely at either of those sections because they both fall under the heading of resource management, something that has gotten sort of discarded with my group. I actually like fiddly things like health and money and equiment, but I'm too lazy to keep track of it myself when I'm GM'ing. The health sub-system seems simple enough that I probably will implement it. I like the going crazy factor. It could introduce a nice random element into situations that will help emphasize the strangeness of being a plant. The negative side is that it could just be too arbitrary and too similar (just becomes PVP for instance).

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Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:14 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Holy christ! Those broccoli are really tough! I am just setting up a mock battle in MapTools to get a sense of game balance and I put a poor little asparagus up against a broccoli, thinking it would be a decent one on one match. No sir! The poor little veggie was unconscious in 2 rounds (though he did get a lucky one health point hit in) and ground into paté in two more.

Okay, let's try a turnip next.

Did you envision the broccoli as a boss type NPC? Where if they are encountered, it is usually alone?

A lot of the really interesting politics are going on over in the Brassica field. I want the players to play as Veggies, but I'd like them to get some involvement with the secret movements going on on the other field. There is no real way for the Veggies to go in undercover. Maybe secret meetings with members of Reform (who have a doublecross planned) who are revealing a Brassica plot to steal seeds from the Veggie Patch for their slave-raising project?

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Tue Apr 14, 2009 9:19 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Yeah, Broccoli are intended to be very tough (that's why they rule the Brassica Fields after all, aside the fact that they're manipulative SOBs). Ideally the PCs would encounter Cabbages and Turnips early on - so I guess calling the Broccoli a type of boss isn't too far off. I'd envision that if encountered there would only be one Broccoli, but they would probably have support with them. So the PCs would need to somehow get rid of the support first, or do something to even the odds in their favour.

I like your ideas for various plots and plans by the Brassica. I agree that not being able to (easily) go under cover is a problem (for both sides). Well, the PCs could get into the Brassica Fields easily enough (get caught as slaves), but getting out might be a different problem :)

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Jason Anderson
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Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:26 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
It strikes me that there are a lot of similarities between the Veggie Patch and WWII, with the Brassica field being like occupied Europe. That's where the intrigue ideas keep leading me.

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Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:30 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Keep talking like that and people might start wondering about your sanity ;)

I guess I can see where you're coming from. And it was always intended that the Broccoli were constantly plotting to take over The Veggie Patch (or at least increase their power), so throwing lots of intrigue ideas into the setting works for me anyway!

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Jason Anderson
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Tue Apr 14, 2009 10:40 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Horribly late on the play (by two and a half months), but you have no idea how excited I am to not only find a thread about The Veggie Patch, but also to see the creator is here. I've been wanting to play it for almost a year now, but I can't convince anyone else of the brilliance of the thing. Jasonga, if you need a playtester, you've got a ready volunteer in me! :D


Sat Jun 27, 2009 1:37 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Wow! Another Veggie Patch fan!

The game went down and it was a blast. I wanted to do a write-up, but I'm still waiting for one of the players (doomfistmonk) to send me the first half of the recording (we recorded it in two pieces, because the recorder ran out of batteries). I'll bug him again and when it's together I'll let you know where you can download it.

In the meantime, there is some feedback about the game here:

http://www.midnightslair.com/forum/show ... 741&page=3

(feedback starts at the first post at the bottom of the page)

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Sat Jun 27, 2009 2:27 pm
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Post Re: [Veggie Patch] What's wrong with the rules?
Corvus - Nice to see that there's another Veggie Patch fan around :-)

Walkerp - Thanks for the link to the feedback. I'm glad your players really got into it, although I think most of the fun they had came from you running a great game. My thoughts on two of the comments.

The system - People are 100% right that the system is very generic and doesn't really capture any feel of the setting. But as one of the other people mentioned the intention was that the system was a simple as possible, and just it stayed in the background so you could get on with the game. I think that's why I'm not totally happy with the system - I feel it's a bit fiddly in places (mainly combat and healing), and doesn't manage to stay in the background there.

Cartoony - I certainly envisioned the game to be cartoony :-) (if I could, I would have had a cartoony front cover with lots of vegetables all doing crazy things over the place - the sort of image where each time you look at it, you notice a new odd thing going on in one part of the picture). Being able to do tricks in combat (and get a bonus from them) was my attempt to introduce some of the zaniness you get in cartoons.

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Jason Anderson
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Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:12 pm
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